Saturn/Hades

 

Saturn/Hades

RPP: The alien.  Enmity.  Sickness.  Prison. Unemployment of long duration.  Serious losses.

Foreign

• Identifying with/influenced by a different country  or nationality     (including spouse)

• Immigrants, exiles, refugees, fugitives. 

• Because of the “alien” attribute, there is an overlap with Chiron

“Enmity; enemies”

• Opposition (to arouse or be the opposition), dissention, conflict

• Multiple manifestations are common, e.g, immigrant who experiences enmity

Karl Marx, Gandhi, Elizabeth Warren, Bernie Sanders. Upton Sinclair.  Some of the critics like Luther and Gandhi were imprisoned or fugitive, not for crime, but for their criticisms.  

• Martin Luther battled the Church. 

Event:  T. Saturn antiscia Hades he wrote the letter that started the Protestant Reformation, causing a schism in the Catholic Church.  (October 1518).   When he defended himself to the Pope, it turned into a shouting match.      Natal minor aspect.

• Upton Sinclair was a critic of various industries.  

Event: He wrote an expose of newspapers.   In retaliation, newspapers would not publish reviews of the book or accept advertising for it.  P. Hades=Saturn.  

His most famous book was about immigrants (The Jungle) Natal Saturn=Hades=Aries

• “Staunch critic”* of the two party system, Ross Perot.  

Event: Began self -imposed political exile P. Hades =Saturn 8' orb.  Lasted through exact contact, 8 years later (Ross Perot)  This could have been symbolized by Chiron aspects. 

* https://www.autonews.com/executives/ross-perot-former-gm-director-and-staunch-critic-dies-89

Bullying

In a small sample of 3 bullies, all 3 had some Saturn/Hades aspect.  

Left to right: Marlon Brando’s father “was something of a bully” Saturn//Hades

From ADB database: He “had a bad reputation as a bully”.  

Actor got famous playing a bully on TV.  Sun=Saturn/Hades >30’ orb.  

              

Judy Garland was bullied by her employer, who called her “a fat pig in pigtails…(her boss) insisted she consume only chicken soup, black coffee and cigarettes, along with pills to reduce her appetite”.*  

Event: On her 16th birthday “she’s not allowed to go anywhere near the cake”.

P. Saturn=P. Hades 1’ orb. (Below)

*https://www.biography.com/actors/judy-garland-pills-diet-wizard-of-oz  

     

 Foreign

· Relocation.  Alien, refugee, statelessness.  

Relocation: commonly international, but not necessarily

· Professions include travel or distant locales   

Giovanni Segantini was a stateless artist with multiple manifestations.  

 

Event:  When he was seven years old, his sister neglected/overlooked their 

citizenship papers, and he was stateless for most of his life. P. Hades 6' from N. Saturn.  Because he was stateless, he couldn't marry, so he lived with partner.  As a result, where ever he lived,  he was condemned by the local church and forced to relocate frequently.

When his sister lost the papers, he also became homeless and lived on the 

streets.  Police committed him to a reformatory where he stayed while the progression became exact.  

It should be noted Saturn/Hades is more benign much of the time.  It’s often just descriptive of a foreign entity or activity.  

• Meryl Streep genius with foreign accents.  

• Lifelong Scottish nationalist born in England

• English writer appears the “The European” magazine on a progression.

• New Zealand writers write about Maori

• The Stranger is translated from the French The Foreigner;  Albert Camus natal.

• Movies, novels about aliens in imaginary locales: Alice in Wonderland, Utopia, ‘Wizard of Oz’.  Judy Garland, Louis Carroll natal.

• N. Venus=Saturn/Hades: They married foreigners: Prince Ranier and Candace Bergen 

Multiple manifestations: foreign + enmity, opposition

“A noted disputant with a number of long-running feuds”, Hilaire Belloc was Anglo/French and spoke French well but at no point could have been taken for a” French person”.  

French/American artist, with an international career.  When her Saturn/Hades square was > 3’ orb, she was expelled from school (the 1st of 3 times) and her father began to abuse her sexually.  Her work had not “endeared her to everyone”  being colorful  “in a minimalist age". Niki de Saint Phalle

 

Marie Antoinette

Event:   She was an immigrant, who was executed in a foreign  country, as a result of the enmity  she incurred when P. Hades=Saturn 1’ orb (minor aspect/sort below left).  N. Sun=Saturn/Hades by major aspect  (Chart below right)

        

Catherine of Aragon

Born in Spain with Ceres=Saturn/Hades, she failed to produce the appropriate offspring and incurred the disfavor (enminity) of her husband,  for the King of England, incurring his disfavor.  Event:  Her final pregnancy, began on a transiting conjunction of Saturn to Hades , the baby was born and died on 2nd conjunction (Feb and November 1518).   After this  she could bear no children and  lost the favor of her husband. 

Sickness  Charts below left to right

Event: Renoir developed arthritis P. Saturn=P. Hades 64H exactly.  

Event: D.H. Lawrence had to leave his job when he first developed pneumonia (which recurred).  He emigrated from UK to US.  Natal semiquare; progression 1’ from exact.  

Event: St. Bernadette’s visions were called insanity by some who wanted her to be put in an asylum.  And she had a long term illness. Hades conjunct N. Saturn.  The opposition to her reports of her visions could also have been seen as enmity.                   

Another RPP delineation for Saturn/Hades is “damage through frost”.  That’s rare but this happened: 

Event: Not frost but coldness: Benjamin Franklin experiment with cooling was successful when a progression was exact.  "One may see the possibility of freezing a man to death on a warm summer's day.".*   Multiple manifestations: this occurred while he was abroad.  P. Hades=Saturn exactly summer 1858.  **https://founders.archives.gov/documents/Franklin/01-08-02-0023 

Saturn/Hades

RPP:  Trouble.  Sadness.  The alien.   Sickness.   Unemployment of long duration, enemies, enmity.   Serious loss.   Prison

Nova Chartwheels:   Severe sickness of long duration.    Unemployment.  Serious losses, obstacles.   Prison.  Enemies, hostility.  Sadness, misery.   Trouble.  melancholy

My own findings:

Foreign 

   Immigrants 

   Identifying with/influenced by a different country  or nationality                              (including foreign spouse).   Sympathy for a country other than one's own 

              Immigrants, exiles, refugees, fugitives.   

    Relocating is common: foreign or domestic, voluntary or involuntary  

    In government: colonialism;  in religion: missionaries.  

Mistrust   

               Bullying  

      Bad time to negotiate at the time of a transit  

      Often multiple manifestations e.g, immigrant as well as enmity  

Sickness

My findings:

Enmity; enemies

Critics of major institutions

Martin Luther (born with minor aspect) Battled established Church and it's reformers.  T. Saturn antiscia Hades he wrote the letter that started the reformation, a schism in the Church.  (October 1518).  His writings cast him as enemy of the pope.  He defended himself to the Pope; turned into a shouting match.  He slipped away at night.    

Karl Marx, Gandhi, Elizabeth Warren, Bernie Sanders. Upton Sinclair.  Some of the critics like Luther and Gandhi were imprisoned or fugitives because of criticism (not crimes!)

Upton Sinclair wrote  newspaper expose "The Brass Check"   Newspapers would not review it; would not accept paid ads for it. P. Hades=Saturn.  His most famous book was about immigrants (The Jungle)

 Bullies: In a small (4) sample of bullies, they all had Saturn/Hades 

Bellock called a "disputant".  Multiple manifestations: he was an alien: spent summers in France and "spoke French well but at no point could have been taken for French children" 

Exile from others:

Began self imposed political exile P. Hades =Saturn 8' orb.  Lasted through exact contact, 8 years later (Ross Perot)

 Foreign

Art:  M.C. Escher Moorish art influence.  Multiple manifestations: sick all his life; on progression there's a class photo sitting alone.   

 Foreign

Professions like missionaries, cartographers.  In government colonialism.

 Relocation.  Alien, refugee, statelessness. 

Giovanni Segantini artist: Childhood of poverty and hunger due to father's unemployment.  His sister neglected/overlooked citizenship papers, so he was stateless the rest of his life. P. Hades 4' from N. Saturn.  He couldn't marry because of his statelessness. Lived with partner as a married couple, causing problems with the church ("condemnation").  Forced to relocate.  Prison: when the progression was exact.  Police committed him to a reformatory (1870)

Foreign + enmity

Event: James II got involved with Africa when P. was 2' from exact.  (colonialism)

Event: exiled with Saturn/Hades SA Aries exactly 12/23/1688.  

As a result of his exile, he fought in the armies of 3 different countries

Event:  influenced by his exile in France, he became a Catholic when progression was exact.  

Confusing event: When progression was exact, his brother put him in charge of firefighting operations in the Great Fire of London, his actions and leadership were noteworthy. He "won the hearts of the people with his continual and indefatigable pains day and night in helping to quench the Fire" .  September 1666.  Is this serious losses?

Prison 

Marie Antoinette executed P. Hades=Saturn (64H/1' orb).  Multiple manifestations: She had been an immigrant 

 Catherine of Aragon Event: She got pregnant on a transting conjunction of Saturn to Hades 1518; baby born and died on 2nd conjunction (Feb and November 1518).  Natal Ceres=Saturn/Hades

Sickness

 Renoir developed arthritis P. Saturn=P. Hades 64H exactly.

D.H. Lawrence P. Hades=Saturn exact "a severe bout of pneumonia"

St. Bernadette had visions T. Hades conjunct n. Saturn; some wanted her to be put in asylum; she had long term illness

 Rare, but this happened: "Damage through frost" 

Not damage but coldness: Benjamin Franklin experiment with cooling was successful when P. Was exact.  "One may see the possibility of freezing a man to death on a warm summer's day."  Multiple manifestations: he was abroad.  Semisquare exact summer 1758.  

Art:

Art:  M.C. Escher Moorish art influence.  Multiple manifestations: sick all his life; on progression there's a class photo sitting alone.   There are often multiple manifestations e.g, foreign and enmity

 Foreigners 

Relocation is common particularly with progression.  Sometimes it's voluntary, sometimes it's forced. 

 French American artist: Niki de Saint Phalle  was expelled from school when P. Saturn=Hades.  Lived wih grandparents to who emigrated to US when P. Hades station=Saturn/Hades.  

Judy Garland "Wizard of Oz" she's an alien.  Before the film she had P. Saturn=P. Hades  she was under-employed, unpopular with the boss. 

Comic leaves home; creates "Comedy Cellar" P. Saturn=Hades exactly (64H)

Meryl Streep ??Accents?  (Elizabeth Warren born the same day is more a critic of the institutions)

Lifelong Scottish nationalist born in England (Compton MacKenzie) 

 New Zealand writers write about Maori

Books about foreign imaginary places:

Lewis Carrol: Alice in Wonderland.  William Howells Dean Utopia.  But not Rod Serling or Thomas More who both had Vesta/Chiron

Albert Camus, author of "L'Etranger", The Stranger, but in French the translation is literally 'the foreigner'.   N. Saturn/Hades=Aries (64H/2')

Wordsworth P. Hades=Saturn appeared in a publication called "The European"

 Enmity:

Remarque The Enemy; his own citizenship was revoked 

Jonathan Winters natal + transit he won an award for "crank calls"

 Diderot stories: 

 Best friends who are so much alike, they can't stop dueling and wounding each other 

Character kicked out because he refused to compromise and wouldn't humble himself by apologizing

 When T. Saturn waS conjunct N. Hades (1771) he wrote an article inspired by someone else's Voyage de Bougainville 

Diderot was, in his own life, imprisoned, had enemies and took an important trip to Russia. 

Saturn trine Hades and Saturn/Hades=Aries minor aspect: A male colleague once quit rather than work under Ms. Norwood's leadership. When he asked to return, she turned him down.

Planet at the midpoint:

N. Venus=Saturn/Hades: Married foreigners: Ranier and Candace Bergen